Pest perspectives EP 26 - Michael Dall - MD Falconry And Pest Solutions

0:01 Hello and welcome to pest perspectives episode 26 quite

0:07 warm again, like last week, it is annoyingly warm, but it's

0:11 doing it's doing good for the Wasps or seasons in full swing.

0:18 For this week. We are live on Facebook,

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0:39 can't see it ever happening but who knows.

0:41 So this week I have got on Michael Dow from MD Falconry and

0:49 Pest Solutions. How are you?

0:51 Hi, guys. How's it going?

0:52 Yeah, I'm good. Thank you.

0:53 Sean, how are you? Good to hear.

0:55 OK, cheers. Yeah, it's been a long time in

0:57 the in the making there. She was like, oh, has it come

1:02 round that quick already? You were like when I sent you a

1:04 message. So you're still good, still good

1:06 for Tuesday. You're like, has it come round

1:08 that quick already? It feels like yesterday you

1:11 mentioned it, but yeah, it's just gone so quickly, so

1:16 quickly. It's been so busy for everyone

1:18 at the moment. I feel that, you know, time's

1:20 just disappearing. Oh.

1:22 Yes, it's the offseason's causing a lot of it.

1:28 I'll be honest. I'm still, although don't get me

1:30 wrong, I mean it's not as rampant as it was, but I'm still

1:34 doing a lot of what's next this week.

1:36 Saturday I did about 10. I would say I'm not counting.

1:41 I would say we're easily over 300 watts nests already.

1:45 I would say, well, I've lost count, to be honest, but yeah,

1:49 I've lost count. But about that ish, maybe more.

1:52 I should count them really, but I don't should should should

1:57 really count them but. Well, yeah, I mean, The thing

2:01 is, this season, obviously, I was going to try and focus on

2:06 bird work, flying the bird's prey and just mostly doing that.

2:10 But I'm so glad I got back into pest control with your rodents

2:16 and your insects because wolf season has just been absolutely

2:20 bonkers, absolutely crazy. I can't believe how many calls

2:24 we're getting for wasp nest this.

2:25 It's insane. Yeah, I know it's, they are

2:30 everywhere because I've recently set up a lot of what by

2:35 management, you know, where you put the they're very good.

2:39 But I've set up three places in our Cricket Club and two pub.

2:44 Yeah, two pubs so far for that. Because you've got oh, this must

2:50 be a friend of yours. Whatever they say, just don't

2:53 read it out. Knock knock, it's a kind of joke

2:58 but report bot 1-2 frame. Guess it's one of your friends

3:03 probably. Yeah, but ignore.

3:07 Them I've set up to two pubs and 1 Cricket Club because there was

3:12 just everywhere and although Pete, you have to tell people

3:15 it's tickets with Ross Bay it's just Scout Wasps.

3:19 But it stops with Ross Bay and you get what's it called?

3:26 That's it. They attract the scout Wasps and

3:30 from the wasp nest they send the Wasps to certain areas and then

3:37 when they don't return, they don't send Wasps that area.

3:39 So you end up with lower numbers.

3:41 You can't guarantee a customer you'll get no, no Wasps, but you

3:46 just say it will reduce it as much as you can.

3:49 You can't in pest control. You can never guarantee you're

3:52 saying you never see another wasp, can you?

3:54 But they are highly effective. But one thing to know there was

3:58 Bain sent out an e-mail saying that they've run out of stock

4:01 basically. So we've we've yes, they can't

4:04 get no more till next year. So we've bought a load and we've

4:08 we've gone around buying a lot of the other suppliers that sell

4:10 them just in case. We've been selling a lot of them

4:14 because they're the ones that only have that are specifically

4:19 tested for Wasps only, will not catch flies, will not catch

4:22 bees. Some of the other ones can't get

4:25 canned, end up with all sorts of them.

4:27 But these ones are specifically designed for this.

4:31 Yeah, for, for that, but selling, selling a lot.

4:36 And do they all? Do all suppliers sell it?

4:39 Yeah, most of. Them yeah, OK, that's something

4:42 I might look into because that might be good for like cafes

4:44 and. I've looked, but when word gets

4:48 out that well, Spain haven't gotten your left, they'll soon

4:51 be bringing round trying to get hold of them because they are

4:56 they work well, but you've got to understand probably you've

4:59 got to talk to the customer as to have it work.

5:02 I've done a seminar on it with the guru.

5:05 I've tried to get him on the podcast and so far I've got

5:08 nothing, but he's like the guru was Carol.

5:13 It's seminar was like from 9:00 in the morning and we got out

5:16 there like 7 at night. This guy's a God damn genius.

5:19 Honestly, I'll. Try that out.

5:22 But it's what Autumn towers use. They they use what they use them

5:26 as well. OK.

5:27 Yeah, that makes sense. That's pretty cool, to be fair.

5:30 It is, but yeah, it's been a good boss season so far.

5:34 And what are you using as your main powder?

5:36 Like when you're treating the nest?

5:38 What are you personally using? I'm tested all sorts really.

5:42 I've been, I've been, I've been, I've been trying Falcon, I've

5:46 been trying deadline, I'll try all different ones.

5:48 But so far I haven't had any issues yet.

5:53 Yet. I'm not going to say just yet

5:57 so, but it's all about trying to make sure you've you've got the

6:02 nests in the right position. But to be fair, a lot of our

6:05 nests have been in easy positions, to be fair, But there

6:10 hasn't been any really tricky ones yet.

6:12 Usually get tricky ones later in the summer.

6:15 Later they get higher and higher and higher.

6:19 Yeah, yeah. But a lot of them have been very

6:21 low level recently. I'll be honest, most of them in

6:23 very, very low level. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

6:26 Easy. It has.

6:29 So it certainly varies. It does.

6:31 It's a funny year. That's definitely been

6:35 interesting. I mean, I remember having the

6:37 chat with you because I was talking about going back on

6:41 Chequer trade. Yeah, Yeah.

6:45 Which seems to be quite. It's quite controversial though,

6:48 isn't it? Chequer trade people.

6:49 Some people love it, some people hate it and.

6:52 Yeah. I mean it's whatever works for

6:53 you. I mean, I mean, we never got

6:56 nothing out of it, but you might get your name out there more.

7:00 But we were we in the RRB, we were quite established already

7:04 so. Yeah, yeah.

7:05 I think for me it's getting my name out there as much as

7:07 possible. I know, I know, I said I wasn't

7:10 a fan of it, but for you it might work.

7:13 It won't work for everyone. Well, every job has pretty much

7:16 been a wasp nest. That's the problem.

7:20 What from check of trade? Yeah, literally.

7:23 I've only been back on it for maybe 2-3 weeks and every job

7:28 apart from maybe 2 have been wasp nest.

7:32 Oh, OK, well. Gets a bit bored.

7:35 Get them, get them to review you because yeah, yeah, because that

7:39 check of trade, all you go on about get the customers to

7:42 review you, get them to review you.

7:44 My issue was at at the time we would have the only pest firm on

7:48 there for 75 miles and they kept saying get reviews on there the

7:53 algorithm, but I said we're the only pest control company and

7:57 they wouldn't listen says I've got no I'll ask for a

8:01 reconstruct since we haven't got one job for York for bum checker

8:04 trade. We should be coming up first

8:08 time, but it's I'll be changing change now.

8:11 Thanks stereo pest killer on LinkedIn for popping in.

8:18 But yeah, now it's been a bit of a yeah, hectic season to say the

8:22 least. I mean, it would even better if

8:24 this season was last year, but. Yeah.

8:28 I mean, people say you always have one good wash season every

8:32 three years. Have you heard that?

8:35 And we we had a terrible season last year.

8:38 Yeah, we had an. Incredible season, the

8:40 three-year, the three years before.

8:42 OK. We were quite good seasons in

8:45 general, but last year was awful.

8:47 We had about 160 the whole season.

8:49 That was it. So, but yeah, you want it is it

8:53 is true, but it's also area dependent as well.

8:57 Yeah, of course and. Where you are in the country, I

9:01 don't imagine you when if you lived in Scotland, you'd have a

9:04 very good wasp season because it's it's I don't think they get

9:08 as many Wasps up there. But I might be wrong.

9:12 But it's true. It's all it's all life cycles.

9:16 You're saying cycles. So it's true.

9:18 Every every insect has its year. Yeah, even the ladybirds are

9:24 everywhere this year. Have you?

9:25 Seen. Yeah, I've noticed a few, but

9:27 I've never really met any customers who say, oh, you know,

9:30 ladybirds are a problem. I've not.

9:32 I've not had it yet. It's Harley.

9:34 Quinn's not a problem. It's not a hard native book.

9:36 It's the Harley Quinn's. I can actually bite you.

9:39 Oh, really? Yeah.

9:40 The Harley Quinn's. If you ever get them in a house,

9:43 you'll see them in the corner of the of the room.

9:46 They'll be bunched up into a like a book all bunched up

9:50 together. They're the Harley Quinns.

9:53 There's about 16 different names for them, but they're not

9:56 native, but they can be. They can be a pest.

9:59 They can be. OK, well, I look forward to

10:02 that, if that's ever, you know, a job that comes through.

10:06 Well, it's simple. It is.

10:07 But you, you, you may get it. What is this next impulse?

10:12 Hello your friends. Yeah, just again, please ignore

10:17 that person. That'd be great.

10:23 They're a nightmare, mate. They're a nightmare.

10:25 How did you get in? Well, they are here supporting

10:28 you, aren't they? They are.

10:30 In some way, yeah, sure. I bet you've lost our Yeah, just

10:37 say that. Don't ignore me.

10:39 Vex is saying it's done. Right.

10:44 We won't let them take over. We won't let them say go for

10:51 that. So with pest control.

11:01 I can guarantee it. I've caught up again now, the

11:07 signals. Are you there?

11:09 Yeah. What's happened?

11:12 Yeah, I'm back. Did they hijack anyway?

11:16 Right. The signals back now I don't

11:17 know what happened there. Yeah, I'm back.

11:20 Sorry. Was you going to ask how I got

11:22 into pest control? So basically, how did you get

11:24 into pest control? Did you work for other firms in

11:27 the past and what was your experiences and training like

11:30 and whatnot? Is that how you did your

11:32 training? Yeah, I mean, it's been a long

11:38 journey, if I'm honest. Pest control.

11:40 I never knew anything about pest control growing up.

11:43 I never even knew it was a job when I was 18.

11:48 Really. OK, it's interesting.

11:51 I wish in schools and stuff they talk about it more, but no,

11:57 never knew it was a job. So yeah, basically AT18I joined

12:03 the military. I did four years in the

12:05 Household Cavery Mounted Regiment, so working with horses

12:09 and I've always had a passion for animals and left there.

12:15 Worked in Australia for a year again with horses and I came

12:20 back and I looked at pest control.

12:24 But I'll be honest with you, when I saw the wage I was just a

12:28 bit like this, like how am I going to survive?

12:31 I was looking at jobs like £24,000 a year and this was back

12:35 in 2016 and I thought that's quite low and through the

12:42 military I got all my HGV licences.

12:45 Yeah. On that, but I wasn't in pest

12:48 control, I was just looking at it.

12:49 But if I'm honest, the wage put me off.

12:52 OK. And then I think it was 2020, I

12:57 started falconry. So I started flying birds of

13:00 prey and one of the guys on my hockey team asked me if I could

13:07 fly the bird for his business, to which I said yeah, of course,

13:11 because I was keeping a Harris hawk at the time and I just

13:15 really wanted to work with birds as much as possible.

13:20 So that was like my opportunity in was through this company.

13:28 So what made you want to? Are you still there?

13:35 Yeah. Yeah, I'm still there mate all.

13:39 Right. A bit of a lag today there.

13:41 Yeah, I can hear you. So what made you have the bird,

13:46 the Harris hawk? What was that about?

13:48 Was that like a pet project or did you know you wanted to do it

13:51 falconry wise? Was it a bit of a like, like a

13:54 pet as such? Because I know the commitment,

13:57 the commitment for for doing falconry is a bit like having a

14:02 a kid, but not a kid. It's all year round.

14:06 It is. Yeah, definitely, mate.

14:13 Anybody who's wanting to get into falconry, it's seven days a

14:16 week. That's the first thing I'll say.

14:18 Yeah. It it's a huge commitment.

14:25 You can't just want to do it for like a day or a week or a month.

14:30 It's it's a lifestyle. Yeah, because I've had, I've had

14:36 obviously I've had other people on and I've said you've got to

14:40 think about things like, well, if you go on holiday, what are

14:44 you going to do? Christmas Day because you've got

14:45 to still see the bird. Christmas Day, things like this.

14:48 It's a whole commitment that you've got to have people in

14:52 place just in case you're a war you something like that, because

14:57 they've still got to be attended to.

14:59 It's a whole dedicated commitment to falconry.

15:02 It is. Like I say, mate, it's a

15:05 lifestyle, it's a passion. If it's your passion, you'll go

15:09 fly your bird Christmas Day without any problems.

15:11 You'll you'll want to, you'll enjoy it.

15:15 That's it's such a such a passion, such a joy where anyone

15:20 who flies birds of prey is so lucky to do so it.

15:25 Does I'll tell you to be honest, I love your videos on Holder

15:28 Instagram and stuff and it's so cool with the music, but I can

15:32 imagine it's very different when you when you do it.

15:36 Oh, you there? I'm with you mate.

15:46 Wait. I don't know what's happening

15:47 there, but there is a tiny bit of lag I'll bring.

15:50 I'll bring one of the Falcons in.

15:52 OK, so if you're watching this

16:06 podcast, you'll see a Falcon in a minute.

16:08 If you're not watching the podcast, it's listening.

16:12 Go and skip to a bit of the podcast on the video and you'll

16:15 see it. I'm talking to people that are

16:19 watching after the fact on Apple Podcasts and whatnot.

16:25 Not whatnot. That's a video shopping

16:28 platform, but all the other podcast platforms like video.

16:33 Hopefully the signals a bit better mate, but we'll see.

16:38 So what's? So what's that hat about?

16:43 So this is a hood. It's called a hood I.

16:45 Can see from. It No, you can't see through it.

16:49 This takes the eyesight away. This is what keeps him

16:52 absolutely calm. Oh, OK, so you've got a hood on

16:56 there. So he's completely calm at the

16:58 moment. He's hoodwinked.

17:00 Very. So would he not be calm if he

17:01 took that off? He wouldn't be calm.

17:04 I mean, he would be, to be fair, I think Ned would be all right.

17:07 But to be fair for this podcast, just keep it on just just so he

17:11 is calm and don't have to worry about it.

17:14 I mean, he's been flown and fed today.

17:16 So to be honest, he he wants nothing to do with me anymore.

17:19 He's he's quite chilled, quite happy, OK.

17:24 So that's that's Ned. What what is here?

17:28 What? What breed is he?

17:30 So he he's a hybrid. So he's a Gio Lana.

17:33 He's a Gio Lana Falcon. So he's 2 Falcons in one.

17:37 That's the best simple way of putting it.

17:40 So Gio Lana, so he's absolutely fantastic.

17:43 So one of our customers is a golf course and they have a

17:49 problem with crows. The crows Peck at the green and

17:54 it's turning the green over. It's looking bear, it's looking

17:57 horrible. A lot of the golfers complain.

18:01 This is a beautiful golf course and their key focus is

18:05 sustainability and using natural solutions.

18:09 So we go there at the moment two to three times a week.

18:12 We fly the Falcons and we fly the Hawks, and this is a great

18:16 natural way of deterring the crows away from the golf course

18:21 and so far we've had really, really good results.

18:24 Is it starting to work then after crows let numbers going

18:27 down? I think we started in March and

18:31 we're now looking at the areas where they destroyed it and it

18:36 the grass is growing back, the green is coming back.

18:40 And yeah, it looks good. It's been effective.

18:45 OK. So you're introducing that

18:47 predator to the crows. They're they're absolutely, you

18:51 know, petrified of Falcons and Hawks.

18:54 You're doing it three times a week.

18:55 You're mixing up the days and the times that you attend.

18:59 And then this is pushing them away.

19:02 We also use other things like bioacoustics, which give off

19:06 distress calls. So it sounds like a progress in

19:09 distress. I've heard them.

19:11 I have heard them before. They're really good.

19:14 I think it works well as like an integrated pest management

19:16 programme. So using that with the birds,

19:20 you stand really good chance of get rid of them or at least

19:25 you're going to lower the activity.

19:29 Yeah, I know. It's a really good eco friendly

19:31 approach and that is the lot of high end.

19:35 I would say you're probably on a high end golf course I would

19:38 say. And they're they're very much

19:40 into the the much more eco friendly approach.

19:45 They are a lot of places are they are now.

19:48 It's the kind of customer base that I'm personally looking at

19:52 is people who want more natural solutions.

19:57 And I think next week I'm doing a survey for a agriculture

20:03 college. They also want to see the birds

20:06 of prey being flown to naturally deter the corvids.

20:11 So again, hopefully we can do a good job there if they take us

20:15 on, OK. Well, hopefully, hopefully you

20:18 get it. So there was a question there

20:20 and someone else is answering it saying it's not.

20:23 It's not best practise anymore. What do I have with?

20:28 It No, no, not that someone was saying someone wants to know is

20:33 it true that to gain control over a Falcon you have to bond

20:37 with it for two days straight, staying awake the entire time?

20:42 Someone's put that's not really the best practise anymore.

20:45 That's is that not that's not true, no.

20:48 So you don't want. So if we're training any hawk or

20:51 Falcon, we wouldn't keep them awake for two days.

20:54 We wouldn't try to break the bird in in such a way that.

20:58 Sounds really old school that does that sounds.

21:00 Like really old school. Yeah, I'm not sure about that

21:02 one. It's not something we would do,

21:04 that's for sure. It takes a lot more time than

21:07 than two days. I'd imagine so, but yeah, that

21:11 sounds like torture isn't fair. You want to stay awake for two

21:14 days? Yeah, a human being staying

21:19 awake for two days is a lot. No, I definitely wouldn't be

21:22 able to do that. Not anymore, that's for sure.

21:23 No, no, no, I wouldn't want to do that.

21:26 No, no, no, no, definitely not. So we've got Roxy here.

21:31 Roxy is somebody I work with. Oh, OK.

21:34 So if it's if you want to know anything about falconry, talk to

21:38 Roxy. I'm sitting there on LinkedIn.

21:42 I think she liked your post or something so I did a seems to be

21:46 I think. Does she help?

21:49 Does she work with you on some of these jobs where you have the

21:53 the cool bird videos? Does she work with you on that?

21:55 Yeah, well, Roxy is actually a Falconer herself and she's been

21:59 flying birds to prey for eight years and she's been working

22:04 with some of the bigger companies.

22:06 We both decided to go self-employed and with the golf

22:11 course and a few other jobs we have, I've asked Roxy to help

22:15 out and she's been just an absolute credit because the

22:20 customers love her. I think the customers see the

22:22 passion with us and the birds. They, they see good healthy

22:26 birds. They see the birds flying.

22:29 And that's, that's how you're going to, you know, win, win

22:32 over the customers and obviously deterring avian pests.

22:37 But definitely. So a bit more technical question

22:41 for you then. Not exactly technical but sure.

22:44 How does it work for Falcon falconry when the bird flu bands

22:49 are in place? How does it work?

22:51 Can you still fly your birds? Yeah, I mean, I've never had any

22:58 of the managers say anything to us.

23:00 We've never been in any areas where there's bird flu.

23:03 And, you know, we have to be extremely careful, OK?

23:08 None of our birds have ever had bird flu.

23:12 So yeah, we've always been OK. Absolutely.

23:16 That's good to hear. That is so obviously you

23:18 mentioned that. Now let's go to that question.

23:21 So what made you want to go self-employed in regards to,

23:26 say, falconry and starting your own pest business up as such?

23:32 Yeah, I think for me was, if I'm honest, when I did my level 2

23:39 training for pest control for your rodents, you know, your,

23:41 your insects and the lore and everything like that.

23:45 I'll say it for you, RSPH level 2 is.

23:49 That. Because, because as you know

23:53 online now, if you say level 20, is that a real level 2 or is

23:58 that yeah, now, yeah, yeah. Because it does say to you to

24:01 prevent the science level 2. It is.

24:04 But I knew what you meant but I dropped it in there for clarity.

24:08 But sorry, carry on. Well, I actually, although I was

24:12 working for a company, I, I paid for it myself.

24:17 And when I got into obviously like the falconry, I, I paid for

24:20 everything myself. So the birds, I paid for the

24:24 GPS, the housing, the training, absolutely everything.

24:28 And that actually came up to about 5000 lbs.

24:31 Wow, so. Well, yeah, yeah, it wasn't it.

24:36 When I was working for a company and I was, I was kind of on a

24:39 lower wage, shall we say, and I was doing, you know, rodent

24:43 treatments, insect treatments, flying bird to prey.

24:46 I, I kind of got to a point where actually I thought, you

24:49 know what, I'm better off doing this for myself.

24:51 I'm going to give it a go. I'm going to give it two to

24:54 three months and see what happens.

24:57 And to be fair, it's been the best decision I've ever made.

25:00 That's. Good.

25:02 I suppose you're happier. Happier as well, because you can

25:05 set your own terms now. You're not being told what to

25:08 do. Oh yeah.

25:09 It, it just, it's like purpose, you know, like if I, if I'm out

25:14 there doing a good job, you feel great about it because you know

25:18 it's the work you're putting in. But equally working like as a

25:24 sole trader, self-employed, if things go wrong, that's, that's

25:28 also down on, you know, that's down to me.

25:30 And you have to take full responsibility for it.

25:33 It's. Part of the learning experience,

25:37 isn't it? You learn from it.

25:38 You do. Yeah, you have to fail to

25:40 succeed to learn. You know, people save that and I

25:43 believe in that. Yeah.

25:46 So what? So with regard to when you went

25:52 by yourself, was it just, I know you've, was it just folk of me

25:58 or was you actually actually doing pest control as well?

26:01 Or was it just folk of me solely to start with?

26:04 Or was it a bit of both? So for the first year I did

26:07 both. I was doing, you know, I was

26:10 doing a lot of subcontracting with the falconry and I was

26:15 using Facebook check and trade, getting myself out there with

26:19 business cards for it was mostly domestic pest control.

26:23 So your rodents, your insects. And the thing I've found is

26:27 that, well, to be honest with you, I completely burnt out.

26:31 I was working maybe 6-7 days a week most weeks with the birds

26:36 and trying to cover all the domestic jobs for rodents and

26:39 insects. And then the thing you quickly

26:41 find out when you're self-employed, you're not just

26:43 doing the pest control, but you're having to go home doing

26:46 the reports, you're having to do the the accounts, your the

26:49 social media, answering emails. And then before, you know, if

26:54 you're working 6-7 days a week flying the birds or doing pest

26:58 control, you've still got to go home and do everything else.

27:01 I was quickly doing like 15 hours a day.

27:05 And I thought to myself, this is great.

27:07 But to be honest, it's, yeah, it's not sustainable.

27:10 You can't. You can't do that forever.

27:13 No, it must be because obviously I'm not in the same situation

27:17 because obviously I work with my dad.

27:19 I do so, although we are one man, well, I'll say 2 man band.

27:24 He does a lot of the paperwork, whereas I, I and he does the

27:28 calls and that. But well, but when I was I take

27:31 all the calls I do, but I've still got a lot to I've still

27:35 got a lot to learn, though I will admit that I'm no, no one

27:39 admits they're an expert. You are right, but you have to

27:42 wear all you have to wear all the hats and you more so because

27:45 it's you're a whole business. It is.

27:48 It's you. If you don't answer an e-mail,

27:51 somebody's going to get RC with you because they they want your

27:54 services. You know what I mean?

27:56 So it's hard to it sounds good that you and your dad are

28:00 working together. I hope one day I can find

28:02 somebody who I can work with to kind of help grow the business.

28:07 I don't think I would be able to do it on my own forever.

28:11 No way. I.

28:13 Mean it gets to the but see, we've like for sake jumping back

28:21 to Wasnes when you have a busy season, you can get to the point

28:26 where you have to have like I went out in the car one day and

28:29 did all the contracts, although the contracts we hadn't finished

28:33 because the Wasnes were getting that busy that we were

28:36 struggling to do both. So it can, it can a good moth is

28:40 it can also sometimes we don't keep on contracts on top of your

28:44 contracts. They can hammer you a bit.

28:47 But we sorted it no problem. We did.

28:49 But but yeah, you might get, you could get to that point where

28:55 you could probably take something on on in the future.

28:57 Just it's a big, I can't speak because obviously he's my dad.

29:02 I'm not deemed an employee. I'm a director.

29:04 So it's different that you'd be looking for more of an employee.

29:08 You would. One day, 100% yeah.

29:12 But so that's different from that perspective.

29:15 So what's the, what would you say in the neck?

29:18 No, no scope on So what, because recently you've changed it up a

29:23 bit and you've gone and joined the National Pest Technicians

29:26 Association. What was the move to that?

29:32 Because it was not me swaying you in.

29:34 I don't do that, do I? I did, I did.

29:36 I just tell you what I think and then yeah, no.

29:40 People think I try and push free, but I don't.

29:42 I'm like, here's what I think. And if you just want to be part

29:45 of the basis prompt, do it. I was like, it's up to you what

29:49 what you want to do. I really appreciate it, like the

29:53 advice you gave me and like I listened to it and of course I

29:57 looked at all all options, but I felt for me that the MPTA was

30:01 the best one to choose. I mean, well, you've got three

30:07 choices, haven't you? Don't join anyone.

30:09 Join the BPCA or join the NPTA. And I think everyone's got their

30:14 own opinions on it, obviously. Very.

30:17 Very divisive opinion on as in as in which one you join, but

30:23 you can't you can't just join the CPD body as well, but that's

30:26 a that's a not join anyone option.

30:28 If you want to use ridenticide now, you have to have a not all

30:33 about you, but in general you have to have been a CPD body for

30:37 next year. Well, you've got to beat it now.

30:40 But so there there not been anything, but it's not a lot, is

30:43 it 40 something # a year for that bit it's.

30:46 Not too bad, is it? It's worth.

30:47 Whatever it is, someone's because I always see these posts

30:50 come up, oh they're trying to RIP us off and someone go why

30:54 someone puts all this money what, £40 a year?

30:58 You don't have to join a trade body.

31:00 It's not a lot of money not making that much money out of

31:02 you. No, you don't have.

31:04 To run a trade body, it's like you can if you want to, but have

31:08 you, have you, have you been more positive?

31:10 Do you feel it makes you look more more professional, telling

31:14 people you're now part of the trade body?

31:16 Has it helped you in any way? I think it has.

31:19 I think some customers will ask you, are you part of any, you

31:22 know, body? Are you part of the MPTA or the

31:26 BPCA? And a few times I was just like,

31:28 actually, no, I'm not. And then you think, well, hard

31:30 in a minute, maybe I should be. And I think it does display, you

31:35 know, the professionalism of it and of yourself and the

31:38 business. And with all the training they

31:41 offer, I think it can only be a good thing.

31:44 And CPDI like that, if someone's a member, they're quite happy to

31:48 talk to you and give you advice if you're, if you're struggling,

31:52 it's all, it's all very positive.

31:54 So I highly recommend it. That's good to hear me as long

31:59 as it's been positive for you and you think it's making

32:02 especially I suppose for the market they're supposed to

32:05 market you're going for a lot of these golf courses have been say

32:10 accreditation looks looks better if you've ever tried with trade

32:14 body and yeah 100. Percent.

32:17 But it but it does. But yeah, I just thought I'd ask

32:21 you because that because you are a new member, you're not.

32:24 You've not been joined very long.

32:26 No. You thought the process was

32:28 like, I sign up and by the next day I mean, no, didn't you?

32:35 But my issue is I'm impatient. I'm just impatient.

32:38 I'm like, I'm like that. It's like I want something.

32:42 I want it. I want it now.

32:44 Yeah, that's pretty much me. Sadly it's it's not a good way

32:47 to be, but it is what it is. But no, it's, it's good to hear

32:52 that you, you like that perspective.

32:54 I mean, just to quote it from, you don't have to be a trade

32:57 body. It's all personal decisions.

33:00 But if you are, if you are buying identity site other next

33:03 year, you have to be in a CPD scheme.

33:07 You have to do your free crew points and you have to, I think,

33:13 yeah, you have to get your 20 points and three of them have

33:16 got to be crew points. Basically.

33:19 It's not, it's not very difficult.

33:21 I will make a video, people definitely explaining it all

33:24 because it's been still, it's people not understanding what

33:28 they've got to do. It's it's quite simple, but I

33:31 will make a I've been meaning to make a video about it because

33:35 the information is everywhere. It's very, very simple.

33:38 But I understand why people are worried because there's a lot of

33:41 people panicking about they're not going to get the points in

33:43 for next year, but I'm sure everyone will.

33:47 They will so so you. Oh OK and here here's the

34:01 question. This is a bit more sensible from

34:04 some of. Your friends.

34:06 Where did you get the name MD Falconry from?

34:09 Unfair Solutions, which I know that one.

34:12 It's obvious isn't. It is.

34:14 That is, that is, that is that from one of my friends.

34:18 Yeah, yeah. Seriously, Sean, just block

34:20 them, mate. Just block them.

34:21 This is this is awful. It's going to get worse before

34:24 it gets better, mate. Just block them.

34:25 I. Don't imagine it's yours.

34:28 Yeah, you're Michael Dow. And you do fold from it and you

34:30 do pest control. Best solutions?

34:33 You'd think they would know that.

34:34 Yeah, I think you'd think they would.

34:38 But yeah, there's been, there's been a lot of, there's been a

34:41 lot of chatting. It's been keeping the comments

34:44 going on YouTube anyway. I'm glad I could bring them on,

34:49 mate. I'm glad I could bring them on.

34:52 But so with what with regards to training, have you have you

35:01 managed to do any, any additional training this year

35:05 or? To be honest.

35:07 With the CPDI, suppose you're busy, ain't you?

35:10 You are. You've been really busy.

35:12 I've been flat out like literally the bird work is

35:16 always quite busy with the Hawks and the Falcons and then I got a

35:22 phone call from my local council asking if I could look after the

35:27 wasp nest because I won't go into it too much.

35:30 One of their employees got stung by a wasp and she found out the

35:36 hard way that she's allergic. So they straight away took her

35:40 away from the wasp nest treatments and they phoned me

35:44 and asked if I could take over, which was great for me.

35:49 Obviously it's a good way of of kind of like slightly expanding

35:53 out a little bit and meeting people.

35:55 I like to think if you do a good job, hopefully you know they

35:59 remember this and you can get other work.

36:02 But you know, it's, it's very early days and I was going to

36:06 continue looking after them, do the Wasnes treatments and hope

36:10 something good comes from it. Yeah, you're right, but.

36:17 I would like to do some training courses and I have looked on the

36:20 NPTA website and yeah some of the courses I'd love to do.

36:26 Well, there's, there's loads of free ones on there.

36:28 There is all your, all your free ones are on there.

36:31 You've got all your health and safeties.

36:33 But obviously you've got a lot less time than me.

36:37 It's all right saying it, but yeah, yeah.

36:41 Yeah. Getting time for you to do it.

36:43 I mean, you've got, you've got, you've also just wrote on the

36:46 road days. I think they're about, you've

36:49 got them too. I don't know if any any are ever

36:52 near you or not. I think one of them was, yeah.

36:56 Did you go? No, I didn't.

36:59 But you. Laughed.

37:00 I was to become a director and I the one was in Nottingham.

37:06 Everyone thought I was going and they were like where?

37:09 Where are you? I was like, I was busy so I'm

37:12 making sure I'm going to the next one in Nottingham and the

37:16 one in Peterborough because I wanted one in Peterborough.

37:19 I was like, come on, Peterborough central to a lot of

37:21 pest controllers. So it's in the diary now.

37:24 It's happened. So I had to book it because I

37:27 was the one saying Peterborough. There's the new location there.

37:34 So I haven't actually been to any actual in person events this

37:37 year. The first one will be Pestech in

37:41 in November. I should I say I should know it.

37:46 I hope we organised the thing so I should know it.

37:49 It is. Hold on, let's have a look.

37:51 Where's my calendar? November because I've got no

37:54 podcast booked that week obviously.

37:58 So it is and I, it's on the Wednesday.

38:00 So yeah, it is Wednesday the 5th of November.

38:05 It's Pestech at Milton Keynes, MK Dons, Marshall Arena.

38:10 If I will be are you, are you, are you going down or not?

38:14 Yeah, 100%. I want to grab Roxy and just get

38:19 her going as well. And then hopefully we can both

38:21 go in November and kind of just meet people really and just it

38:26 would be nice to. Yeah, but not stay alive.

38:31 It really would, yeah. Even you know, I've not met you

38:34 in person yet. It'd be nice to obviously meet

38:35 you in person, but just just everyone really like anyone who

38:38 wants to chat. It'd just be nice to, you know,

38:41 whether it's work related or wherever it wherever else it may

38:44 be. That was usually a lot of, I

38:47 can't remember, I can't obviously say about this year,

38:50 but last year there was. They're fucked.

38:53 They have Falcons there. Yeah, daily.

38:56 Last year Daily Environmental were there with all their birds

39:00 talking to people. They were very well known

39:02 company. Good falconers, yeah.

39:04 Yeah, daily, daily. Oh yeah, that was that was last

39:08 year's, but we'll see what this year's.

39:12 We'll see what this year. But as I can't obviously say

39:14 yet, but a few bits have been let out of the bag on that.

39:19 But yeah, that's that. So that's the first in person

39:22 one I'll be going to this year. OK.

39:25 I've already got like 42 points. So you're right.

39:30 Well, on basis prompt, I've got the 23 I have.

39:35 You see a British pass register, I'm on both.

39:38 You see, I'm basis prompt, British press register.

39:41 You can log a lot more things or points than you can on basis

39:46 basis prompt. You can log 6 podcasts or I can

39:50 log every single beauties and beasties podcasts going.

39:53 Anything I learn on though I get even more on the other register.

39:57 It's self registering. OK, that's cool.

40:01 But I know you're with basis prompt, didn't you?

40:04 You are to get you started. Yes, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

40:07 And the British Pest register as well.

40:11 Oh, what? You went with both.

40:13 Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. I wanted to just assess which

40:16 which to you know, what they offer and which one I like the

40:20 best really are. You to get your points logged.

40:24 The British pass register is the quickest and that's not.

40:27 Not saying that, but I bet you've heard the comment a lot

40:30 online, haven't you? Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah,

40:33 definitely yeah, yeah. So yeah, I mean, I'll.

40:37 See what you think? Isn't it really so you?

40:39 Think everybody's going to like their own thing and it's

40:42 whatever works for you? It is so.

40:46 Have you come into any difficulties or say cons,

40:54 negatives? Obviously being just you by

40:57 yourself, it's negatives, distress and the extra work or

41:01 has there been any, any kind of challenges It might help others

41:05 like any pros and cons, obviously, but go for the cons

41:10 where because obviously you brought it up in the pest

41:13 control groups. There's always these questions

41:15 come up there. I don't know if there were go

41:19 that alone. I'm working for a company, I

41:21 don't know what, I don't know what to do.

41:22 And it comes up time after time after time.

41:25 It does not these groups it does.

41:28 Whenever I'm on Facebook, I always see it.

41:30 It's like, you know, somebody works for a company, they say,

41:34 should I go self-employed? What are the pros?

41:36 What are the cons? And for someone who's been doing

41:40 it for two years now, I could quite happily tell you what the

41:44 pros are and I can tell you what the cons are.

41:46 It's like anything in life, there are pros and cons.

41:49 I think the problem is it's bit of like a myth.

41:52 When people think they're going to go self-employed, they think

41:55 that everything's going to be rosy and everything's going to

41:58 be amazing. You can just do what you want

42:00 and you get more time to yourself.

42:03 It's the complete opposite. That's what I found is that

42:06 actually I don't take any days off at the moment.

42:11 I can't remember the last time I had a week or two weeks off.

42:14 Now, admittedly, it's because I work with birds and it's a

42:18 lifestyle. You're with them seven days a

42:19 week. And I've made that choice and

42:22 I'm I'm happy with that. But you know, if you take a day

42:26 off when you're self-employed, you're not going to get paid for

42:29 it, are you? No, you're not.

42:32 I think that's a con. Obviously, like, you know,

42:34 everybody loves money, but if you take time off, you're not

42:36 going to get paid. You've.

42:39 Got to build that. You've got to build a bank

42:41 balance of get a big bank balance in the bank first.

42:46 How can you guarantee that? How can you guarantee it?

42:48 You can't. No, you can't.

42:51 You can't. I'll give you like an example.

42:54 I've worked my socks off and I did a really good month and then

42:58 the month later the turbo on my van went.

43:02 And you know, I'm quite open about this.

43:05 By the time I had it fixed and by the time I'd hired another

43:09 van. Now, maybe this was a bad

43:11 business choice. I I don't know, but you got to

43:13 live and learn, you know, it's £5000 down.

43:19 So you know, yeah, I think for some people that would most

43:24 probably take you out. The game with this was like

43:26 early days. This was like first like 6

43:29 months. Well, yeah, you're right.

43:32 A lot of people that when they took out, if you're still

43:35 starting off on your own right in the battle, you're still

43:38 there. Oh, mate, you, you won't stop

43:42 me. I, I get tired, but you won't

43:44 stop me, that's for sure. But yeah, you know, of course

43:49 the hardest part, I think maybe when you're starting off on your

43:52 own and maybe you don't have all the connections or whatever it

43:58 is, is, is finding your customers and then doing a great

44:03 job and then keeping your customers.

44:05 I think that's so important and that can be a challenge

44:09 sometimes. I'll tell you what that is all

44:12 to my dad always said because we we're a lot of our was Nest

44:16 customers, not all of them, but a lot of them are pair people

44:20 that say oh, so and Mr so and so.

44:23 I did a was Nest for us two years ago and we get a lot of

44:28 repeat business with regards to was Nest.

44:30 But I'm not saying which companies, but there are

44:33 companies, big, big companies out there.

44:37 They basically try and get the highest price they can or don't

44:42 do the job properly, etcetera and they lose the customers,

44:46 whereas we'd rather, we'd rather do a good job and try and keep

44:51 that customer happy. Then they ring us or they

44:53 recommend you and that is always try and keep them happy.

44:57 Even if it's not always try and keep them happy because they'll

45:01 they'll recommend you or they'll come back to you in the future.

45:05 And it can happen where sometimes someone don't know

45:09 what don't know what, not saying obviously who over the years

45:12 it's done a whatness it's not worth and they rang them back to

45:16 get them back and they won't come back or they won't answer

45:18 the phone, whereas we will return to fix the problem.

45:23 Wait, wait. And that's not a local

45:25 competitor by the way, at all. That's not big ones.

45:28 Just think big ones but the. Great thing about whatsness I've

45:33 found as well. It's it's like quite a small

45:36 job, I would say, but I've, if you just look at my cheque

45:40 trade, I've only been on there three weeks.

45:42 I've had really good reviews so far.

45:45 I've done a good job for a customer through cheque trade

45:48 and a was nest and then that's led on to something else.

45:52 So like this agriculture college I'm going to survey next week

45:56 that's come from a was nest job. That he's really good.

46:01 I'll be honest, you've hit gold there if you get it.

46:03 That's really. Good, I hope.

46:05 But you wouldn't then. You wouldn't have thought during

46:09 the boss nest could have led to a survey for for a potential

46:13 contract. Which is which is good.

46:15 It is. So the the chap I did it for, he

46:17 was a tree surgeon and he was like quite impressed with the

46:23 with the work I did. He, he actually met Ned with me

46:27 as well. He was very happy to meet Ned

46:29 and he asked a lot of questions about the birds.

46:32 He asked a lot of questions about what I do and he didn't

46:37 even tell me he was going to do it.

46:38 I just got an e-mail from this college asking if if I could

46:41 come do a survey and how interested they are in seeing

46:45 the birds, prey, fly, etcetera, etcetera.

46:47 And they've asked about some proofing works as well.

46:51 So yeah, just a little wasp nest job can completely change it for

46:55 you. We can, I mean, I'm, I'm, I'm

46:58 really impressed from that perspective because obviously

47:02 not the same kind of elk, but we wanted to wasp nest for somebody

47:07 and we ended up, we ended up landing a contract on a, on a

47:10 commercial. In fact, we've had it for a few

47:11 years now. And it was all because he says,

47:14 do you do normal pest controls? Yeah, do everything, anything we

47:17 don't do as we don't do birds we don't but boxes or everything

47:23 else. Yeah.

47:25 And that that was from Boss Ness.

47:27 But because she but as you say, like like when my dad first

47:32 started, he didn't get his first job for six years.

47:35 It six months, sorry, six months.

47:39 And it's something he built upon.

47:42 He did it on the side as a side business to start with and he

47:45 built it up over time. But like he said, he had no

47:48 contacts. Like you, he had nothing.

47:50 OK. So it's it's getting all them

47:52 connections. It took him a long time to get

47:54 to the point where he took me on.

47:57 It took him a long time to to get there.

48:01 But I'd imagine this. Is what's so rewarding.

48:04 It's it's a lot more different. There's more ways to get your

48:07 name out there now than the wars when he started.

48:10 It's very different now, but it's still getting your name out

48:14 there. But it's worked for you though

48:15 so far. So check of trades worked.

48:18 You were right. In, in, in that sense, yeah,

48:20 100%, yeah, 100% it's worked. But then this is the other

48:27 thing. When you're self-employed,

48:29 you're going to, you have to be the salesman and or saleswoman,

48:32 you have to sell the job, you know.

48:33 So I'm going to have to do this survey next week, which I'm

48:35 excited for. But of course, you've got to let

48:40 the customer know why you're coming in, what you're going to

48:43 do. And, you know, I've never been a

48:45 surveyor. I've never had to sell jobs

48:47 before. It's that it's another skill,

48:48 you know? Oh no, I 100% agree.

48:51 I'm not, I'm learning, I'm I'm not the best at selling, but

48:56 over time I've become better. Like I'm I'm still waiting to

48:59 use this, this thing Mark Porter told me to do.

49:03 What main concern? What's your concern?

49:07 Listen back to the Mark Porter podcast before you go to the

49:11 survey. I've listened to it.

49:12 I remember this. I remember this.

49:13 Yeah. That's the one and I haven't

49:15 had. I haven't got to try it yet on a

49:18 new place, but I'm going to do it.

49:21 I am. That's good, yeah.

49:25 Hopefully that should help you. But you are right, it doesn't

49:28 come natural to a lot of pest controls like me.

49:30 I'm not natural salesman, but you've kind of you've got to be

49:34 as well. You've got to try to be.

49:36 You have to, but you don't believe in yourself.

49:39 The author You don't want to come off as too pushy always

49:42 what I've you need to strike a balance, don't you as well?

49:47 Yeah, and that's the skill. That's the skill, isn't it?

49:50 Like, yeah, definitely, yeah. I think as long as you're

49:53 confident in what you're doing and what you're selling,

49:56 realistically it shouldn't be a problem.

49:58 But yeah, it just, I think it just, it just takes time, you

50:02 know? It does.

50:04 It does. It's it's like what you're one

50:09 of your friends called Ian Woods too.

50:12 There's a right party. There's a right party going on

50:15 on YouTube. I've ignored most of it.

50:18 Yeah, that's the deal on NATA. Rather, they're right.

50:20 Oh, Natalie. Yeah, yeah.

50:25 But. Is it helping?

50:26 Is it helping to grow to YouTube?

50:27 Like if they chat. Well, probably, yeah, the

50:30 algorithm is probably, I don't, I don't really know, but they

50:35 are chatting, but. Just don't repeat anything the

50:38 same mate. Right.

50:40 But, but yeah, you're right. It's a, it's a, it's a new thing

50:43 you're learning and it's about the site.

50:46 I mean, I, I think you'll be all right.

50:47 Because they're obviously keen to to use to try a different

50:53 approach, maybe birds or yeah, just try and lie, Yeah.

50:59 The head gardener's obsessed with birds of prey, so Oh well

51:02 there. You go, then you might have your

51:04 foot in the door. See if you if you if the head's

51:07 garden like like you might be in the door.

51:10 They're the ones who used to keep happy on certain sites.

51:14 They're the ones who used to keep happy, definitely, you

51:17 know? He's the one who's called us in.

51:19 He's the one who wants to see the birds.

51:21 But you know, it's it. To be honest, it's quite easy to

51:25 sell with birds of prey because people love them.

51:30 But you do need to remind the the customer of like, you know,

51:34 why we're here. It's a service to to naturally

51:37 deter avian pests. And that's what we're coming in

51:40 to do. But you know, it's great seeing

51:42 the birds, holding the birds, watching them fly.

51:45 But we're there to to get rid of, you know, corvids, goals,

51:49 pigeons, whatever it may be. And that's your question.

51:54 I know this, I know the answer. You can't use birds of prey to

51:59 actually attack animals, can you?

52:01 No, we don't. No, no.

52:03 No, no, no. So I heard, I heard something

52:05 called an American podcast where they can it's so really I, I

52:11 don't know whether it's right or not, but I, I heard that they,

52:13 they went to squirrels and stuff like that, but.

52:17 I mean, you can hunt squirrels if you want.

52:18 If you've got a really good red tail hawk, yeah.

52:21 Maybe, yeah. I was like, they can't, they

52:23 can't do that in England as far as I'm aware that that's not a

52:26 they're just a deterrent. They are.

52:28 Yeah, that's what we do. It's a natural deterrent.

52:30 And the the other thing is you wouldn't want to.

52:32 Like if I was flying one of the Hawks and I caught a pigeon,

52:37 that pigeon might be riddled with diseases which can be

52:40 transferred onto my hawk. You could.

52:42 You could. I may have got the wrong end of

52:44 the stick of it, but it did sound that way but I might have

52:47 got the wrong. Yeah.

52:48 I'd like to hope. I would like to hope I got the

52:50 wrong end of the stick. Because once again, though, they

52:54 they don't really do what they're told today is that, is

52:56 that correct? Exactly, I was just about to say

52:58 that if one of my birds has got a full crop from a pigeon and I

53:01 show it a chick, it's not going to come back.

53:05 So what's the trait, you know, when you get a like, how do you

53:09 keep like say someone's getting to folk from it?

53:11 How do you do it? Do you have to buy a bird or you

53:14 have to go and do training first?

53:15 Or how how does it work for someone?

53:17 What is doing folk from me? What's the process?

53:21 Everybody's got a different approach and what I'd also say

53:26 is in this country, sadly there is no like route to follow,

53:31 which is like professionals so to speak.

53:34 This is what I've found anyway. A lot of people will go on to

53:37 the Five Days Raptors Awards course.

53:42 Personally, for me, I found a mentor, a decent mentor.

53:48 So when I say a mentor, I'm talking about someone who flies.

53:52 So the guy who taught me, Nigel Hawkins, he's flying eagles,

53:56 he's flying Hawks, he's flying Falcons, He's a, he's a true

53:59 Falconer, not just somebody who's had a Harris hawk for 20

54:03 years and, and bangs on about how great he is.

54:06 That's, that's going to get you nowhere.

54:09 So I had a really good mentor who taught me absolutely

54:11 everything I needed to know. And then the rest you kind of

54:15 have to go out on your own and you know, you have to fly birds

54:18 to learn. It's the only way, I think.

54:20 But obviously you're going to be.

54:22 It's there, it's there. Like if someone was interested,

54:25 is there a way somebody could say not to you or someone else?

54:30 I'm interested, could I come and watch you?

54:33 Would that be recommended as well, like to come and watch you

54:36 or something? No or.

54:37 Not I get so many people asking, oh, I want to do your job, I

54:41 want to do what you do. And yeah, they think it's, they

54:46 see a pretty bird, they see it on the glove or they see it

54:49 flying well. And they just think, you know,

54:52 it's that easy. And I always say to them, look,

54:55 it's seven days a week. You need to understand it's

54:58 seven days a week. And I don't think people fully

55:01 understand that until you keep birds, you wouldn't realise just

55:05 how much time goes into it. If, if a guy's flying a bird or

55:09 even walking through London with a, with a tame healthy bird,

55:14 it's because that person's put a lot of work into that bird.

55:18 If they look like they're you know, they're in hate swear

55:21 here, but like crack feather and they're facing off the glove and

55:25 they're screaming, you know that this guy or lady has no idea

55:29 what they're doing. Does that happen then does that

55:33 happen? I don't know.

55:33 Because I've seen it, I've seen it our shows.

55:35 I've seen, yeah, the birds just baiting off.

55:38 I've seen all the feathers in bad, bad way and in a bad way.

55:41 And yeah, you're just being, you know, you're not, you're not

55:46 showing falconry in in a good light.

55:48 I'm. Surprised though it shows shit

55:51 they get away with that because people look a bit nowadays.

55:54 People are bringing the RSPCN stuff over, stuff like that,

55:57 don't they? They're very you don't know what

56:01 I'm saying is you know what? You know what changed?

56:02 20 fives like the way the world is.

56:04 The camera phone comes out. It does.

56:08 Oh, oh, look at this animal. I was dealing with a property

56:13 the other day that had a goal trapped in the netting and they

56:17 called someone called the RSPCA, but to be honest, they they

56:21 didn't really do much. No, that's just that's one

56:27 instance. I'm sure they're great and you

56:29 know, I know they are, but in this example we didn't, we

56:32 didn't really see much happening.

56:33 So I don't know, I don't know enough about it to be honest.

56:36 But with that one experience, that's what I witnessed.

56:39 I. Mean you can't go on what you

56:42 see. You can't.

56:43 Yeah. Yeah, but I'm sure they do a lot

56:45 of great things behind the scenes.

56:47 And I imagine what they was this netting higher on top of a

56:50 house. No, this was on a a building, so

56:54 like offices. And what happened?

56:56 They had taken the netting down. Oh, because they were going to

57:00 do some construction work. But when I say they're taking

57:02 the netting down, they've just left it in like a bundle all

57:05 over the rooftop. And the goal was stuck in in the

57:09 the herring goal was stuck. In the that the person didn't

57:13 want to go up go up on top of a building.

57:16 Maybe. Who knows?

57:18 The ladders and stuff, they probably didn't want to go up

57:20 there. They just didn't seem too fast,

57:23 to be fair. But hey.

57:25 Oh, OK, maybe. Maybe it's too.

57:27 I don't know. Yeah, I didn't see, I was only

57:31 there briefly, but what I saw there wasn't much going on,

57:33 which was a real shame, but yeah.

57:35 I mean, did you release the goal?

57:37 Did you go in the 9? I'm not too sure.

57:40 Can't contain contain. Yeah, yeah.

57:46 I mean, when I'm next back on that job, maybe I can ask and

57:48 hopefully get an honest answer, but.

57:51 Who knows, but yeah. Yeah, Have you ever?

57:58 What's it called? I've obviously heard Beauties

58:02 and Beasties podcast. They've had, they've had a few

58:04 folkers on, oh, a couple I can't remember.

58:10 And there was mention that do you go into these folk and

58:13 regroups? They reckon they're quite not a

58:15 good place to go. And that was it.

58:18 Sean Mooney was on about it because one of his labs has now

58:21 got got they do folk. He's really into it.

58:26 And he said the group, the groups on Facebook are very

58:31 toxic. They're not very, they're not

58:33 very friendly places to be. If you want to learn they're

58:37 not, do you? Do you go in them or not?

58:40 Yeah, so I'm part of a Facebook group.

58:42 I think most people will refer to Falconry Hub.

58:46 OK. And to be fair, it's tricky.

58:50 Like when you get in, when you say like you've been flying

58:54 birds, prey maybe for like 5 years and you're flying Falcons,

58:58 you're flying Hawks, you're doing a good job and someone

59:00 comes up to you and says I want to do what you do and you know

59:04 how much hard work you've put into it.

59:06 And then you've got someone who just sees something and they

59:10 don't really see the full picture and they're asking you

59:13 to train them like just randomly or they're asking certain

59:17 questions. I think some people just get a

59:20 bit annoyed about it. I appreciate it.

59:24 I can see what you mean, maybe because people might say the

59:27 same for if someone kept saying can you teach me pest control

59:32 going to a course, a lot of people would say, but you are

59:35 right. It's just it's more, it would be

59:37 harder. I think it would be harder to

59:39 become a Falcon and it would be a pest control because there's

59:42 more commitment with regards to the bird.

59:46 There is. I think there's a lot more

59:48 commitment obviously because there is.

59:50 You said that, but I can't. I can't see why people would get

59:54 a bit ratty. So from that perspective, what

59:57 you've just said? Yeah, and a lot of the guys on

1:00:01 there are a bit older than us, shall we say.

1:00:03 And you know, they just, they haven't got time for it.

1:00:06 You know what, I don't blame them.

1:00:07 I kind of get it. But at the same time, I do get

1:00:09 it if you're new and you really want to do it and you're

1:00:12 passionate about it and you're generally asking for help

1:00:15 because you know you want to do it.

1:00:17 You will struggle, you will find it hard because there's very few

1:00:21 people, good people, who will want to teach you falconry.

1:00:27 No, I, I, I understand that it's, it's, well, it is a

1:00:33 specialised area of our industry, very specialised.

1:00:39 It's not, it's not something I don't think the pest, I don't

1:00:42 think it's not even something pest control companies could

1:00:46 even run courses on. Don't get me wrong, I'd say the

1:00:49 likes of D league could probably do their own for their own staff

1:00:52 coming in, but it's not a thing like they could really run on a

1:00:57 regular or anyone. But say a company like D how big

1:01:01 they are. They've got their own actual

1:01:04 volcanry division. They could probably if someone's

1:01:07 experienced in volcanry, they could come in and they could do

1:01:10 a bit like that. But I don't imagine that you

1:01:12 know how you see, you know, pest control courses, etcetera.

1:01:16 I don't think that's something that could be done with

1:01:18 falconry. I've never seen it and I think

1:01:21 that's the reason why. As to what you've said, it's not

1:01:24 something that can be done really.

1:01:26 I mean falconry and using birds of prey for pest control. 2

1:01:31 completely different things. You know, falconry is a sport,

1:01:34 it's an art. Flying a Harris hawk or

1:01:37 possibly, you know, a Falcon for pest control is is different,

1:01:41 you know, you know, I follow one of the ladies from Deeley's on

1:01:46 Instagram and she's she's brilliant.

1:01:48 She's a great Falconer, but she's a Falconer first.

1:01:52 Yeah. I think that's important to be a

1:01:54 Falconer first to understand falconry and the birds of prey.

1:01:59 And then if you want to do it as a job where you can have a

1:02:03 business or possibly make money, it's looking to pest control if

1:02:07 you do it properly. Well, there's some good tips

1:02:14 there for people that want to get into falconry.

1:02:17 It's trying to have a home. The fact that it is a major

1:02:19 commitment, it's like having a kid basically without having a

1:02:24 kid. If you get the commitment I

1:02:26 mean. Yeah, definitely.

1:02:28 And look, I'm still learning myself.

1:02:30 I think any decent Falconer is always learning about their

1:02:33 birds, about other birds, about Valkyrie in itself is I'm still

1:02:38 learning and there's many better falconers than me.

1:02:42 But The thing is I'll always be honest and I'll always do my

1:02:45 best to learn. And I think if you're always put

1:02:48 in the bird 1st and you're trying to do the best for the

1:02:51 bird, you're going to be on a good path.

1:02:54 That's. Good.

1:02:56 Then it's some good advice. That is because it's definitely,

1:03:00 it's an area. It's an area people like to hear

1:03:03 on podcasts about birds. It's not something that comes up

1:03:07 so much in our industry, even though it is it is part of the

1:03:12 industry. It's I hate to say this though,

1:03:15 that compared to our industry, it's the more niche section,

1:03:19 isn't it? There's not as many folk and

1:03:22 rain in certain areas. It's a highly, highly needed

1:03:26 area and say, say, say waste sites areas you do in London,

1:03:33 places like that. It is.

1:03:35 It is needed because from what I gather what I'm but in between

1:03:40 the lines from what you've said and other people, it's a lot of

1:03:43 big companies as well subcontract people like you to

1:03:48 do their work. I don't know if you do suffer

1:03:50 anymore, but a lot of them, all the big nationals, they

1:03:53 subcontract people out to do their work for them rather than

1:03:58 having their own in house team, they do as well.

1:04:02 I mean, I think a lot of them would prefer to have in house,

1:04:07 but again, it comes down to have you got somebody who's committed

1:04:11 to falconry, to birds? Have you got someone who?

1:04:14 Knows what they're. Doing can, can they house them

1:04:19 correctly? Do they know what they're doing?

1:04:21 Are they doing the weight management correctly?

1:04:23 You know everything. And generally, if, if I'm being

1:04:27 honest, most of the subcontracting I've got at the

1:04:31 moment is, is because the guy they've taken on full time is

1:04:35 most probably lied about it. They've done a really bad job

1:04:39 and then you know, something's gone wrong and they, they've had

1:04:42 to subcontract it out. That's not all companies.

1:04:44 There's some great companies out there, don't get me wrong, but

1:04:47 it it has happened. OK, OK, someone called Callum.

1:04:55 Oh God, yeah. Back on Facebook.

1:05:02 Yeah, he's having a party here, isn't he?

1:05:05 Oh, it's out somewhere else. Or is he?

1:05:07 Is he coming from YouTube? Now he's on Facebook.

1:05:09 No, no, no, no. He's coming from everywhere,

1:05:11 mate. That's what he does.

1:05:16 But he just said hi. That was all.

1:05:18 Is that it? Yeah, out of the minute.

1:05:21 Just blocking mate. I need to follow us.

1:05:24 I'll keep him in there. Yeah, well, I hope I'm kind of

1:05:32 giving some insight to like being self-employed falconry.

1:05:37 I mean, this is my first first podcast.

1:05:39 I'm very nervous but I'll. Be honest, I think you've done

1:05:42 very well. OK, I'm quite a good judging

1:05:46 character on who's you don't look nervous, that's all but but

1:05:53 I've been doing it a long time. Obviously this is 26 podcasts in

1:05:58 in pest control, but I used to previously do it without me and

1:06:02 the more of an audio podcast and I've done it for years.

1:06:07 I've done podcasts since 2020 all.

1:06:10 Right. I used to interview people as

1:06:12 well, but it was in gaming, the gaming related setting.

1:06:16 But now it's all on video. So obviously over the years I've

1:06:19 got better and better. Then eventually I'll it wasn't

1:06:23 always the plan. I was like, I'm going to do a

1:06:25 pest control podcast. I had a word with the beauties

1:06:29 and beasties first to see what they thought about it.

1:06:32 Yeah, obviously I don't want to upset the apple cart, but they

1:06:35 were fine with me. I don't.

1:06:37 I'm not on the same night as them and I do offer, even though

1:06:40 we I do interview people, I do come at things at a slightly

1:06:44 different angle as well. It's not always the same, the

1:06:47 same. So you do learn something.

1:06:49 I try and bring a different angle what I do with it?

1:06:55 Yeah, but competition's good, right?

1:06:56 There's two podcasts, you've got 2 to choose from.

1:06:59 Yeah. There's 2, but it's more, it's

1:07:00 like Sean said, it's more, more, the better, more help educate

1:07:05 people more, more information. And I think to be honest,

1:07:08 they've been great. And Callum said you said you've

1:07:11 done a great job on the podcast. He must have been watching.

1:07:14 He reckons you've done well. Cheers, Callum.

1:07:16 That's very nice of you mate. There we go.

1:07:18 That's a nice comment for. You, you've done a great job

1:07:21 mate. Did he call me mam or man?

1:07:24 Man. Man.

1:07:26 OK, good. Of course, all man.

1:07:28 No, I took it away too quickly. But yeah, thanks for coming on

1:07:33 SO. No, thank you, mate.

1:07:34 Thank you very much. It's good to come.

1:07:37 It's good to have you want. Anyone's listened and they kind

1:07:40 of like want a friendly chat about maybe that you're worried

1:07:44 about going self-employed and you want a bit of advice.

1:07:47 I'd be more than happy to talk to anyone and to talk to people

1:07:51 about the pros and the cons. If you want to know a bit more

1:07:56 about birds of prey, I'm always happy to talk about it.

1:07:59 But really, if you want to know the insurance and outs, talk to

1:08:02 Roxy. She will teach you everything

1:08:04 you need to know. She's she's probably like, you

1:08:08 shouldn't have said that, but the end might blow up now.

1:08:14 That's all right. I don't mind.

1:08:16 I might have to see if I could get Roxy on the podcast.

1:08:19 Yeah, I think you should, mate. You remember back in the day

1:08:21 when they used to do that water bucket challenge and you know

1:08:24 they throw the water over your head and then you give Nate?

1:08:27 Yeah, well, next time I think you should get Roxy on it.

1:08:29 The. Water bucket challenge you

1:08:33 ain't. Yeah.

1:08:33 But no, no, no. Well, yeah, you can Chuck a

1:08:35 bucket of water over if you want, but no get around.

1:08:38 Yeah, yeah, we're on for the stay in the future if she wants

1:08:45 to. I'm always, I always like to get

1:08:47 different people on, but I'm never, I never pressure anyone.

1:08:50 If someone doesn't want to, I just say I won't.

1:08:55 I won't be offended. I always tell people I'm not

1:08:58 because it ain't for some people, because.

1:09:00 No, no, no. Sure mate, she'll she'll love

1:09:03 it. Get Roxy on here.

1:09:05 Thanks for watching. Yeah, and please.

1:09:07 I don't know if you've got Carl coming on, but do you?

1:09:10 Talk to Carl, I'm sure. Did I?

1:09:12 I don't. I'm sure I speak to him, Yeah.

1:09:18 Is he from? Is he from?

1:09:21 That's it. I'm Yeah.

1:09:23 He said he'd consider it in the future.

1:09:24 I'm sure he did. I can't remember if it was him.

1:09:27 I'm sure it was. I asked him again at some point.

1:09:31 Have you got anyone you want to come on the podcast?

1:09:34 Nah, just Roxy mate. OK.

1:09:38 Or maybe Callum? Is he in pest management?

1:09:44 No. No, but he's an electrician

1:09:46 mate. He's a pretty good one to be

1:09:48 fair. But no, I'm sure we've seen a

1:09:50 few rats before. Well, my, my, did you see my

1:09:54 electrician mate that tagged me in a post the other day on

1:09:57 TikTok? No, someone's lost.

1:10:00 Yeah, he's put it on Instagram. I'll send you it.

1:10:03 The video. He's about some poo in in

1:10:07 someone's loft, big poo. He's like, he sends me poo

1:10:11 pictures of rats and all, and he actually put the video on and

1:10:15 tag me. He's like when you've got a pest

1:10:17 control mate that likes seeing turds.

1:10:20 I was like, I think it's a cat and someone's part.

1:10:23 I think it's ours. I don't know what it is but he

1:10:27 got about 8000 views on TikTok. It does.

1:10:30 Right, well get Callum start sending me some pictures then.

1:10:34 Or I'll, I'll send you the the Instagram post.

1:10:39 He's on all the platforms now, but he's an electrician.

1:10:43 He's he's got into YouTube now. He's got a YouTube channel.

1:10:45 He does all video electrical videos and that he's paid a lot

1:10:48 of money multi electrician. He's he paid the YouTube course.

1:10:53 He's trying to grab his business for YouTube as well and content.

1:10:57 But yeah, sorry about that beyond bringing up bringing up

1:11:00 Ted on the podcast, but there we go.

1:11:03 It is, it is rated not for kids anyway.

1:11:09 I always rate it not for kids just in case but But yeah,

1:11:14 thanks for coming on. And you will if you win the

1:11:17 British pest register. If you want you will be able to

1:11:20 block your CPD once I've I've done it.

1:11:24 Or you can self register either way, but you're probably looking

1:11:28 at an hour one point and 15 minutes one point probably.

1:11:34 But yeah, thanks for watching everyone and.

1:11:37 Cheers guys. Next, next week, let's have a

1:11:40 look. I'm going to, I'm going to tell

1:11:41 you who I've got. Always forget.

1:11:45 Oh, I've got I've got Nathan Clark from Petty Force.

1:11:51 He's actually from my area. He runs into my my areas as

1:11:55 well. So yeah, that's, that's a

1:11:57 different spin. Having someone that's been

1:11:59 better. I mean, I had Mark and George on

1:12:02 from Best Force Northampton and although we're technically not

1:12:06 competitors, they do they do because he does a lot of B work

1:12:10 in a way. I don't do BS but he is kind of

1:12:13 local to me. So I thought different spins,

1:12:16 getting more local people on as well, but not everyone wants to

1:12:20 come on. But yeah, well, yeah, that's

1:12:24 fair enough. Yeah.

1:12:26 So I appreciate your time, mate. Thank you.

1:12:27 Thanks. Michael for coming on no.

1:12:31 Cheers, Sean. Oh, and I'll have a good night.

1:12:35 I'll see you, I'll speak to you soon and I'll see everyone,

1:12:40 everyone on the next podcast or if you're listening on demand,

1:12:45 give us a review, Spotify review.

1:12:49 It would do great. Spotify, the honourable

1:12:52 platform, honestly, for downloads, it does really well.

1:12:57 But yeah, thanks everyone. I like.

1:12:59 Have a good night, Michael. Take care, Sean, Take care.

1:13:02 And you take care. Alright, Thank you.